What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

New rules on licenses pit states against feds

1/11/08

Highlights

NEW: Tighter rules aimed at bolstering security, but foes say they go too far

NEW: States will need to seek waiver if they need more time to comply

Civil liberties organizations have argued against rules' impact

Cost of program was reduced in effort to garner states' support

WASHINGTON (AP) -- Residents of at least 17 states are suddenly stuck in the middle of a fight between the Bush administration and state governments over post-September 11 security rules for driver's licenses -- a dispute that, by May, could leave millions of people unable to use their licenses to board planes or enter federal buildings.


The new rules are aimed at protecting Americans, but civil liberties officials say they go too far.

1 of 2 Homeland Security Secretary Michael Chertoff, who unveiled final details of the REAL ID Act's rules on Friday, said that if states want their licenses to remain valid for air travel after May 2008, those states must seek a waiver indicating they want more time to comply with the legislation.

Chertoff said that in instances where a particular state doesn't seek a waiver, its residents will have to use a passport or a newly created federal passport card if they want to avoid a vigorous secondary screening at airport security.

"The last thing I want to do is punish citizens of a state who would love to have a REAL ID license but can't get one," Chertoff said. "But in the end, the rule is the rule as passed by Congress."

Chertoff spoke as he discussed the details of the administration's plan to improve security for driver's licenses in all 50 states -- an effort delayed due to opposition from states worried about the cost and civil libertarians upset about what they believe are invasions of privacy.

Under the rules announced Friday, Americans born after Dec. 1, 1964, will have to get more secure driver's licenses in the next six years.

The Homeland Security Department has spent years crafting the final regulations for the REAL ID Act, a law designed to make it harder for terrorists, illegal immigrants and con artists to get government-issued identification. The effort once envisioned to take effect in 2008 has been pushed back in the hopes of winning over skeptical state officials.

To address some of those concerns, the government now plans to phase in a secure ID initiative that Congress approved in 2005. Now, DHS plans a key deadline in 2011 -- when federal authorities hope all states will be in compliance -- and then further measures to be enacted three years later.

To make the plan more appealing to cost-conscious states, federal authorities drastically reduced the expected cost from $14.6 billion to $3.9 billion, a 73 percent decline, said Homeland Security officials familiar with the plan.

The American Civil Liberties Union has fiercely objected to the effort, particularly the sharing of personal data among government agencies. The DHS and other officials say the only way to ensure an ID is safe is to check it against secure government data; critics such as the ACLU say that creates a system that is more likely to be infiltrated and have its personal data pilfered.

In its written objection to the law, the ACLU claims REAL ID amounts to the "first-ever national identity card system," which "would irreparably damage the fabric of American life."

The September 11 attacks were the main motivation for the changes.

The hijacker-pilot who flew into the Pentagon, Hani Hanjour, had four driver's licenses and ID cards from three states. The DHS, created in response to the attacks, has created a slogan for REAL ID: "One driver, one license."

By 2014, anyone seeking to board an airplane or enter a federal building would have to present a REAL ID-compliant driver's license, with the notable exception of th

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

The so-called "secure" driver's license is nothing but a backdoor entry for a national identity card. This isn't Europe. Hopefully, we'll NEVER have something like this.

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

THis is funny stuff about your identity being known by the governement:

http://www.members.shaw.ca/grandmafa...eringpizza.htm

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

Just because I'm paranoid doesn't mean they aren't after me... :eek:

I'll never be able to order pizza over the phone again. Now you'll only see me ordering carryout... in dark sunglasses... cash only... on my bicycle... ;)

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

I'm for a more secure ID. As a matter of fact, I'm for anything that can any way, shape or fassion, improve the security of this nation... yes, even if it does cause a little heartache to me and Joe Public. The American public as a whole shouted, stomped their feet and flat out begged the government to be more proactive after 9-11 (yes, I know before that as well). Its coming folks, and already here, and it will be American just as apple pie on the 4th of July. Live with it or get the heck out of the way... have a nice day!:)

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

We already have a Real ID. card it's called a Social Security Card that number is on every form you fillout or they ask you for it.

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

Look, I think that our country has become extremely complacent on this issue to the point that it scares me. The reason why we haven't had a major terrorist attack in the U.S. since 9/11 is not so much because terrorism isn't an issue, it is simply because we have been very lucky. Our intel and military has saved us many times in the last 6-7 years, though we don't hear about it thanks to the media's lack of interest and our wish to keep these things secret for good reason. Many powers we gave the government to handle this have helped to possibly save us from these attacks, which now some people aren't happy about because they are a little bit in the gray area. Getting rid of these powers and abilities in my view is suicide as it has saved us before and I don't see the danger of Big Brother that some people are complaining about on those power issues.

Now having said that, I don't see how this is going to fix the terrorist problem at all. Going in and taking out the known networks here in the U.S. is one way, acting on suspicious activity that hints towards terrorism is another good way, building fences on our borders and securing them with military and put in some effort and deporting people who are here illegally and taking care of known "trouble makers" is an excellent way, ending this stupid talk about disarming our civilians and instead properly educating people how to use a weapon and not get our pants in a knot when a teenager does something stupid and acknowledge what events like Virgina tech are "domestic terrorism" and not blame free people for a few screw-ups is a great idea. Giving our military the funding they really need to function to their full potential is an excellent idea.

To me this issue is different. To me this will lead to massively expanding the size of Government that can be abused in so many ways in the future that unquestionably leads to big brother, that will likely not be enforced properly and will not work due to loop holes that the "Black Market" always seems to find is not the solution if you ask me. The Government governs the best when they govern the least. They just need to better utilize the powers they already have instead of giving themselves more powers they will most certainly mishandle and abuse.

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

I agree with the very last paragraph of what you're saying, RLSH. This is why I was against the formation of the Homeland Security Department and immediately institutionalizing it as a Cabinet-level operation. Who's to say exactly what in 50 or 100 years will be considered a "threat" to security in the U.S.? Will it be old people who insist on driving their battered up old Dodge Challengers? Will it be those strange people who continue to express the idea that their "Christian God" is more important than the government? I'm sorry, but World War II posed a MUCH greater threat to the security of the U.S. and yet it didn't require institutionalizing a government entity that has the very real potential of completely trampling citizens' rights.

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

Some of us have forgotten 9/11 already. Before 9/11 we went to fight the enemy on the soil of some far off land. Now our enemy has the ability and will to bring the war to us.. Most Americans have no defense against an enemy in their own back yard. Hell they won't do anything about drug dealers standing in front of the house selling drugs to their kids.

When they return, and they will, I will be ready and I hope HS is as well.

Have guns, will travel!!

RE: What do you think about getting a "Real ID" (very secure drivers license).
 

Sorry, Paladin, but the Nazis could and DID bring the battle into America in World War II. Ever hear of saboteurs? One of my mom's cousins was killed ferrying a plane from a Boeing factory that had been sabotaged. And he was far from the only person to be killed inside the continental U.S. by such acts. Admittedly, they didn't do the strategically worthless thing of knocking over skyscrapers. The saboteurs in WWII actually fought from a military standpoint -- which is why they call today's criminals (and that's what they really are) "terrorists."