ORIGINAL: Yankee
To play a little "devil's advocate" here if I may...
If Daimler "drove its fangs into Chrysler and sucked the blood right out of it", as one poster put it - if it wasn't for the Daimler takeover, would we not have the Charger/300/Magnum and ultimately our Challenger - since these cars are based on the Mercedes E-Class platform? Would Chrysler have some up with these cars on their own without someone like Daimler calling the shots? Personally I kinda doubt it - I think we'd still have interpretations of FWD Intrepids running around (not knocking Intrepids, mind you, but I think the Charger is a vastly superior car), and forget about the Challenger - V6 FWD Avenger/Stratus R/Ts would probably be as good as it ever got as far as any "sporty" coupes are concerned.
Seems to me while the Daimler takeover might not have been such a good idea in hindsight, some good DID come out of it. Anyone else agree or am I way off base here with that assessment?
I would say that it was possible this would have happened anyways. The demand for the LH cars (Intrepids, 300Ms, Concordes) was diminishing as time went on with an increase in competition. I believe the 1999 Charger Concept was a sign that this was the direction they were planning to go towards. It is also quite possible that had this merger not happened, the Charger would be on the LH platform. The LH platform was designed with the capability to switch over to RWD in case the FWD large car formula failed to succeed as it had for them with the Dynasty/New Yorker/Fifth Avenue/Imperial & Premier/Monaco. We saw this potential when they built the Prowler.
I would say that the Charger being vastly superior is based on one's interpretation. The Charger is superior when it comes to performance no doubt as it has the Hemi engines as options; however, without that I'm not sure how the rest would stack up. The styling is subjective. Many liked the aerodynamic styling of the Intrepid and the 1999 Charger Concept ran off of that mentality which few found as controversial as the Charger they produced. The interior in my view is no contest with the fact that everyone complains about it on the Charger and few ever complained about the interior in the Intrepid. Just compare them for yourself.
On top of this, I have heard over and over again from the dealerships that they preferred having the Intrepids as they sold easier.
Likewise, I'm going to play devils advocate here. Let's assume that the LX cars would have never been produced if Chrysler had remained independent, and let's assume that they are "vastly superior" in everyway to the LH cars and that far more customers buy them than the did with LH cars. Before the merger, Chrysler was in outstanding financial shape. They had more money than they knew what to do with. Now they are on the verge of going bankrupt. Is having one superior car line worth the death of a company? What other models did Daimler make superior to their predecessors?
The Caliber gets horrible gas mileage, slower, and in my view less attractive looking than majority of the Neons.
The Avenger/Sebring although on paper sound superior having a Chrysler best V6 in the car line and having their latest transmission, has unique features and styling, and so forth, but it is under performing the sales of the duller Stratus/Sebring. On top of this, the first generation Stratus/Cirrus/Breeze that was built under the Eaton/Lutz era had won awards like the Car of the Year for 1995 and been on the best lists for MT and C&D. The 2nd gen Stratus under German management got nothing. The same was true with Chrysler's minivan line during the Eaton/Lutz era it got the 1996 Car of the Year award from MT and was on the C&D top ten list for years. The 01-07 under the German management was never on either list. The Dakota and Durango are without a question much weaker offerings than they were under Eaton/Lutz watch. The Ram has remained competitive, I'll give them credit for not screwing up that model. The PT Crusier was conceived by the Eaton/Lutz era; therefore, they can split the credit for that.
Also, look at the number of failed models under both management. About the only failure I can think of was the Breeze as it only lasted one generation as it was uncompetitive without having a V6 offering. The Laser, Talon, & Stealth failed, but in fairness those weren't Chrysler models anyhow and their Mitsubishi equivalents were either redefined or discontinued. New Yorker version of the LHS wasn't as popular and was dropped. The small badge engineered Eagle division failed, but that provided Chrysler with the popular 300M. Beyond that everything was a smashing success. The failed models under the German management are as followed: the Crossfire, Pacifica, the Magnum, Durango, Aspen, Commander, Sebring coupe, Stratus Coupe, etc. The Germans couldn't get anything to succeed that was originally their idea beyond the Charger & 300. The Magnum was a failure so I do not view that is good per sey. Also the 300 has failed to be maintain the luxury image that the 300M had before it.
The other problem is that Chrysler was working on dual-clutch transmission before the merger and the Germans killed that and told them to continue to use the 4-speeds and their W5A580 instead. Big mistake. They also fired a lot of the talent that the company had which is why they have had to rely on others to a degree. Any gains the LX platform has given us is insignificant with everything they messed up.
Andre@Edge, I might have missed read you post and interaction, and for that I apologize. I'm just wanting everyone to know that for too long we have allowed things to happen on here that shouldn't be tolerated, and I'm letting it known that it will not be tolerated. I know that saying in which you referred, I just know last time there was a discussion about politics and who won the election this caused a bunch of fighting and inappropriate behavior and this is a blanket warning that if anyone starts to become unreasonably unfriendly or starts attacking, the tread will be shut down. You can debate as much as you want, in fact I encourage it. If anyone disagrees with what I have posted go ahead and challenge what I have written and tell me why you disagree, just be tasteful and respectful and I will reply in a tasteful, respectful manner. Enjoy!