Notices
General Dodge Challenger Discussions Discuss anything related to the new Dodge Challenger within...

How to compete with the upcoming GT500 and ZL1

Old 12-16-2011, 06:35 PM
  #1  
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 4,057
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default How to compete with the upcoming GT500 and ZL1

2013 Ford Mustang Shelby GT500 Official Photos and Info – News – Car and Driver

With the Camaro pegged at 580 hp and the GT500 at 650hp, it looks unlikely that our naturally aspired 392 hemi will be enough. There are one of three options that the company has in order to compete and lets get past the worst possible solution first so we can dismiss it and move on.

Option 1 (The worst possible choice). They could use a Ferrari 4.5L V8 from the 458 Italia which produces 562 hp at 9000 rpms & a measly 398 ft-lbs of tq at 6000 rpms or the Ferrari FF 6.3 V12 which produces 651hp at 8000 rpms & 504 ft-lbs of tq at 6000 rpms.
Advantages: The press would love the refinement and Ferrari's ego would be stroked.
Disadvantages: Either one would at the bare minimum double the price tag, would make the 426 hemi look like a prius in terms of fuel economy, not have the right characteristics for a muscle car, be extremely expensive to maintain, be questionable in quality,...oh and it just might drive Challenger fans away as it is not a Chrysler engine let alone anything that resembles what a muscle car should be.



Option 2 (The option to copy cat others strategy). They could look into either supercharging or turbocharging the Hemi.
Advantages: It is a strategy that has worked for others so in theory it could work. This could also be added to the 300 and Grand Cherokee to compete head to head the same successful way that their competition uses.
Disadvantages: 1. Me too vs. Chrysler history. Chrysler historically does not do well in the me too strategy, look no further than Chryslers attempts in the SUV market aside from Jeep. Neither Dodge nor Chrysler has been able to keep a consistent SUV offering like their competition. On top of the fact that the Challenger is longer and heavier, it will likely not be enough to give them the edge they need. 2. Although Chrysler is in much better shape than they were even a year ago, Chrysler probably needs to put a priority of their money in projects other than a "no guarantees" efforts on the mainstream changes (new interior for the Challenger, continuing to upgrade normal engine line ups, upcoming transmissions, other behind the scenes stuff, etc.). 3. Fuel economy. The supercharged variant of the LSA 6.2L V8 in the Corvette results in a drop from 26 mpg to 21 mpg, being that there are the CAFE standards to worry about and that the naturally aspired SRT-8s fuel economy numbers are already tied with the supercharged GT500 at 23mpg, this might be a problem. 4. Supercharging increases the weight of the model.

Option 3 (Continue the Chrysler strategy: there is no replacement for displacement or cylinders):
Consider this: The Challenger is already the biggest and the heaviest needs something more bold and unique to fits its personality, the Challenger is more expensive than its competition, the Challenger is more unique in being the most similar in design with its heritage than its competition, despite all Chrysler has been through they have one unique weapon that neither GM or Ford has which could potentially blow away its competition factor WITHOUT removing the potential and effectiveness for the aftermarket as what has happened with the Mustang (many aftermarket companies sell more powerful supercharged Mustangs but it seems to make little difference and pose little to no advantage in tests). In short, drop in the V10 that they are about to use in the new Viper.

Advantages: 1. Cost. This already fits in this platform as shown by the Drag Pack, and due to the use in the Viper the cost of production could be lowered through economies of scale combined with sharing the cost of keeping the engine competitive between at least two models if not five models (Viper, Challenger, Charger, 300, Grand Cherokee), 2 Unique: this is would stand out from the competition in the fact that it doesn't rely on forced air induction and will get a ton of attention. 3. Tuner versions: Look no further than the Hennessy Viper of 2005 that through twin turbos, intercoolers, and slight boring and stroking, they increased doubled the output from 500hp (at that time) to 1000hp & 1100 ft-lbs of tq. Imagine what the upcoming version could have. 4. Legacy: the V10 is based from the small block line (including the 340 T/A) that was offered in the original. 5. Maybe fuel economy: the last Viper got 22 mpg on the hwy, I don't know what the changes will be but if they either intend to use GDI or multi-air (if that is possible) it could possibly be more efficient than what a forced air inducted hemi would be. 6. Weight: if I remember correctly the hemi has a cast iron block which I believe made it heavier than the aluminum V10.

Disadvantages: 1. Passing emissions, 2. cost 3. could take sales away from the Viper.

What do you think?
__________________
"To Debate and Moderate" since 2006

College Graduate:
B.S. in Marketing
A.A. in nothing

The first 426 Dual Quad member.
The first to 2000 posts

RLSH700 is offline  
Old 12-21-2011, 09:24 AM
  #2  
Super Moderator
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Posts: 4,503
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

I am a for V10 Viper engine. For longevity and reliability, I am not a big fan of forced induction but am a big fan of there is no replacement for displacement. This will hopefully help with the economies of scale down for that engine in both cars.
As for taking sales away from the Viper, who cares. If you get an order from a Challenger or Viper at least Chrysler is getting the money instead of GM or Ford or some else.
__________________
For I know the plans I have for you," declares the LORD, "plans to prosper you and not to harm you, plans to give you hope and a future. Then you will call upon me and come and pray to me, and I will listen to you. You will seek me and find me when you seek me with all your heart.
Jeremiah 29:11 is offline  
Old 12-22-2011, 07:10 PM
  #3  
Super Moderator
Thread Starter
 
Join Date: Jan 2006
Location:
Posts: 4,057
Likes: 0
Received 0 Likes on 0 Posts
Default

Originally Posted by Jeremiah 29:11 View Post
I am a for V10 Viper engine. For longevity and reliability, I am not a big fan of forced induction but am a big fan of there is no replacement for displacement. This will hopefully help with the economies of scale down for that engine in both cars.
As for taking sales away from the Viper, who cares. If you get an order from a Challenger or Viper at least Chrysler is getting the money instead of GM or Ford or some else.
That is obviously my feelings as well. I think the Viper has its own audience just as the Corvette has its own audience despite the Camaro. I think that the fuel economy issue will be there with either option and I think the cost is inevitable.
__________________
"To Debate and Moderate" since 2006

College Graduate:
B.S. in Marketing
A.A. in nothing

The first 426 Dual Quad member.
The first to 2000 posts

RLSH700 is offline  
Related Topics
Thread
Thread Starter
Forum
Replies
Last Post
HEMI5.7
General Dodge Challenger Discussions
0
07-18-2012 12:08 PM
Cuda340
Off Topic
2
02-18-2011 07:16 PM
stevelegel
Challenger News
0
07-28-2009 06:07 AM
BLK 6050
Off Topic
8
01-28-2009 05:10 PM
DSkippy
Challenger News
5
05-03-2008 09:19 AM


Quick Reply: How to compete with the upcoming GT500 and ZL1


Contact Us - Archive - Advertising - Cookie Policy - Privacy Statement - Terms of Service

© 2019 MH Sub I, LLC dba Internet Brands

 
  • Ask a Question
    Get answers from community experts
Question Title:
Description:
Your question will be posted in: