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Big Three to shift into '08 models

Old 09-22-2007, 06:34 PM
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Default Big Three to shift into '08 models


Hmmm? Would that be the 5.7L and 6.1L??????


Big Three to shift into '08 models


By George Spaulding

Saturday, September 22, 2007


It's new model time! Yes, on Oct. 1, the 2008 automotive model year begins. The date affects all of us because our vehicles officially become one year older.

This column reminds readers of the new car announcement date every year. Otherwise, you would not realize the latest versions have arrived. The carmakers no longer hold introductions until the first of October; they prefer to announce the new models as they become available. That explains why the Buick Enclave, for example, hit the dealer showrooms this spring as an '08 model.

As a service, today we will highlight "what's new" for the most notable changes for the domestic brands: Ford Motor Co., the Chrysler Group and General Motors Corp. Next week, the imports will be featured.

Ford

It is good to see the Taurus, formerly the hottest-selling brand, coming back. It replaces the Five Hundred, which was a less-than-stellar performer. It is important to note that the Taurus has not been rebadged, but there are some 500 engineering updates along with a bigger V-6 engine and a six-speed gear box with the automatic.

The Mustang has a new Shelby convertible with a racing package available for 2008. The successful Focus receives a face-lift and a hands-free communication group for phones and music.

The big news at Mercury is that the Sable has returned, replacing the Montego. It comes with a new 3.5-liter V-6 with 263 hp and a six-speed speed automatic transmission.

The Lincoln Navigator now has a power liftgate, heated and cooled front seats and a power-folding third seat.

Chrysler

The Chrysler 300 now has eight models, four engine choices and two wheelbase options engineered for it. The 300 is referred to as "America's rear drive car."

The Sebring now has a new convertible. The Chrysler Town & Country and Dodge Grand Caravan feature "Swivel 'n Go," which transforms the vans into a dining car, according to Car and Driver magazine. "The second-row seats pivot to face rearward, allowing passengers to belly up to an optional removable table for a rousing game of euchre with those in the third row."

The Dodge Avenger replaces the Stratus, with a good deal of Dodge Charger incorporated in the new model. The Dodge Challenger retro comes with two Hemi V-8 engines from which to choose. The Dodge Magnum receives a face-lift plus a 425-hp engine, and the Dodge Viper, a serious challenger to the Corvette, now delivers 90 hp more.

General Motors

Buick must be pleased with the notices it is receiving on the Enclave CXL AWD. Here's Car and Driver: "Buick's big new wagon delivers excellent all-around utility comfortably and quietly and looks good while doing so, inside and out."

In the meantime, the LaCrosse and Lucerne have been beefed up with V-8 power, a derivative of GM's Northstar; and appearance freshening.

Cadillac was so confident of the upgraded CTS that it had a fleet tested at the famed German Nurburgring 15-mile track. Also, the interiors are rated tops in GM. Motor Trend called it, "The best damn Cadillac sedan in 50 years." The '08 STS now has a 302-hp V-6 with a six-speed automatic, and the XLR has an added LTD edition.

For Chevrolet, the big news for 2008 is the new Malibu, finally a worthwhile competitor with the Accord and Camry. It has grown 3 inches in length and 6 inches in wheelbase, with interior and exterior designs intended to attract younger buyers.

The '08 Corvette has an all-new 6.2-liter V-8 rated at 430 hp and comes with a Z51 Suspension and power-boosting exhaust. Top speed is 190 mph. Chevy HHR adds these new features: OnStar, a tire-pressure monitoring system and StabilTrak, which integrates traction control.

Pontiac's G8 rear drive gets a six-spee
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Old 09-23-2007, 08:05 PM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

I'm afraid so. If they had something more than the 6.1L, they wouldn't have advertised the 6.1L's output. They are going to post the highest numbers they will have available. They need to learn that you can't keep leaving engines unupdated between models, let alone generations.
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Old 09-23-2007, 09:45 PM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

Correct me if I am wrong but didn't we all suspect the 5.7 & 6.1 to be the most likely offerings in the V8 as they are on the Charger/300/Magnum platform already? You sound unhappy. What were you hoping for?
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Old 09-24-2007, 03:52 AM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

Exactly what I expected. We should remember that they have a performance division sRT and they are complemented by Mopar Performance. 425 HP is nice, real nice. If you should need more, and I will. Then you can put bolt ons that will put you over 500HP. Thats the reason we have Mopar performance. But a lot of folks want bragging rights to stock HP and performance figures. Chrysler has always answered that with a performance division. So get what you want from Mopar and also won't void the warranty in most cases.
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Old 09-24-2007, 04:38 AM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

I hate to branch of topic but i must know. I live in the tri-state arena of GA/Tn/AL and i seen someone from AL driving a Charger "daytona" edition and it said "RT" on the front grill. I asked him if he was pleased with the performance, he ignored me and drove off. Anyways whats the difference betweet rt/srt/srt-8? i know ive seen the srt-10 vipers (seen one friday night). Whats horsepower and Liter difference?
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Old 09-24-2007, 08:30 AM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

ORIGINAL: Puthy

....... whats the difference betweet rt/srt/srt-8? i know ive seen the srt-10 vipers (seen one friday night). Whats horsepower and Liter difference?
LX/LY platform - R/T = 5.7L Hemi V8 (340-350 hp)
SRT 8 = 6.1L Hemi V8 (425 hp)

SRT (in general) refers to the premium performance package offered for a model.
SRT 10 is available in the Viper.
SRT 8 is available on the Charger, Magnum, 300 and Jeep Grand Cherokee.
SRT 4 on the Caliber.
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Old 09-24-2007, 11:09 AM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models


ORIGINAL: awsure

Correct me if I am wrong but didn't we all suspect the 5.7 & 6.1 to be the most likely offerings in the V8 as they are on the Charger/300/Magnum platform already? You sound unhappy. What were you hoping for?
Well here is what I'm not entirely thrilled about. The 5.7L & 6.1L are perfectly fine engines, but the problem is the competition is catching up. I'm not concerned about whether or not the Challenger will be able to out run the Mustang versions, I'm concerned about the Camaro. To be perfectly honest, how many times did Ford win in the category of engine output against the F-body cars in the latter years of the pony car wars? Only when they made a rare expensive model, the Cobra R. Defeating Ford's effort is very simple as they do not update their engines very often, but defeating GM takes more effort. Chrysler is more than capable of defeating GM with the Hemi as they have done many times, the problem though is that GM is putting in their best effort into fighting and Chrysler is not if they do not update their engines. The 6.2L that they are offering in the Corvette on paper has the 6.1L licked supposively. I want to see Chrysler offer the 6.4L at least for the top of the line model. Just to stay competitive the Challenger has to match their competition, in order to stand out, they need to offer more power than their competition.

Beyond that, I think it would be a good idea for the sake of being considered a dramatic step up over just a better looking platform with a left over powertrain from the LX, the Challenger's 5.7L should receive a power upgrade as should the 6.1L. A power upgrade should be more than just 10hp, it should be a more significant increase that will stand out. They are about to upgrade the Hemi for the next generation trucks, they should give the Challenger whatever upgrades the truck is going to get is most of my point (perhaps the new VCT system they are now using on the Viper's updated V10).
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Old 09-24-2007, 11:22 AM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models


ORIGINAL: BootCamp

ORIGINAL: Puthy

....... whats the difference betweet rt/srt/srt-8? i know ive seen the srt-10 vipers (seen one friday night). Whats horsepower and Liter difference?
LX/LY platform - R/T = 5.7L Hemi V8 (340-350 hp)
SRT 8 = 6.1L Hemi V8 (425 hp)

SRT (in general) refers to the premium performance package offered for a model.
SRT 10 is available in the Viper.
SRT 8 is available on the Charger, Magnum, 300 and Jeep Grand Cherokee.
SRT 4 on the Caliber.
The SRT line varies in what is expected from one type to another. The small SRTs (SRT-4 and SRT-6) generally is modified by forced air induction (turbocharger and supercharger respectively). The larger SRTs (SRT-8s and SRT-10s) are simply higher output, NA engines.

The first SRT-4 was offered on the Neon with the old 2.4L turbo (about 230hp & 250ft-lbs of tq), the current one is supposed to be offered on the Caliber with the new 2.4L "World Engine" turbo (engine output was originally rumored to have 300hp & 260ft-lbs of torque but it is down to about 285hp & ?ft-lbs).

The short lived SRT-6 was on the Crossfire with the MB 3.2L supercharged (330hp & 315ft-lbs of tq).

The SRT-8s as Bootcamp explained offer the 6.1L Hemi and are offered on the models he listed.

The SRT-10 was offered on both the Ram and the Viper, the Ram version appears to have been discontinued probably due to the changes made to the new V10 engine. The new SRT-10 Viper produces 600hp & 560 ft-lbs of tq. The Ram SRT-10 produced about 500-505hp & 525ft-lbs of tq.

The SRT line is currently the top performance package offered with Dodge, Chrysler, and Jeep. In truth, the R/T badge would make more sense to be used on Dodge products instead of the SRT badge. What is currently labeled as R/T would be more logical to rebadge as ES or some other badge. On some vehicles (the Viper) offering the SRT badge is really a waste of time as that is the only engine and transmission offer and really the only version in production. It would be better to save that badge and use it later for a higher performance package.
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Old 09-24-2007, 12:02 PM
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Default RE: Big Three to shift into '08 models

They will update the 5.7L in the cars I'm sure of it, but the question is, how long will it take to get to the cars. This is a different company mind you, but how long did it take to put the 5.7 in the cars from the trucks? I can't remember for sure, but I think about a year. Even then it lost ten hp from the truck to the car due to the exhaust being tighter or whatever the excuse. That won't be to impresive if that happens from the Ram to the Challenger. To me this engine doesn't really belong in a truck that's meant to two anyway. Maybe if you were racing it. RPMs for power and torque are just to high to tow with.
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Old 09-24-2007, 04:18 PM
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ORIGINAL: Axel

They will update the 5.7L in the cars I'm sure of it, but the question is, how long will it take to get to the cars. This is a different company mind you, but how long did it take to put the 5.7 in the cars from the trucks? I can't remember for sure, but I think about a year. Even then it lost ten hp from the truck to the car due to the exhaust being tighter or whatever the excuse. That won't be to impresive if that happens from the Ram to the Challenger. To me this engine doesn't really belong in a truck that's meant to two anyway. Maybe if you were racing it. RPMs for power and torque are just to high to tow with.
Very true, the lazy Daimler management is not in absolute control anymore. It took two years for them to get the Hemi into the cars; however, that could partly be blamed on the fact that there weren't any cars at that time that would use it as the LH cars (Intrepid, 300M, Concorde, etc.) were still in production and the LX cars were still being developed. If you want to go by the offical year offerings, it would be two years as the 2003 Ram was the first vehicle to get the 5.7L and the 2005 300C/Magnum R/T were the first "cars" to get the 5.7L. The engine hp output dropped by 5hp; however, the tq increased by 15 ft-lbs. The lower restriction exhaust the hp actually has a 5hp increase over the Ram. The truck spec 5.7L is tuned for truck duty, the car version is tuned for car duty.

Anyways, my point is that they are going to make some kind of update to the Hemi in the Ram and I believe it would be wise to offer this ASAP in the Challenger so then they can set a higher benchmark and keep fighting full effort in the muscle car wars. The upgrade that they are planning for the truck would also help the Challenger. A rumor holds it might be a form of VVT, which helps to make the power band be more consistent and helps the fuel economy as well. The way I see it, it couldn't hurt. What I would like to see more than anything else would be GDI (Gasoline Direct-Injection). That seems to be a popular new way to improve performance and it's supposed to help fuel economy.

On the other hand, it might be a good idea to wait a couple years into production to make this change over. Increasing the engine output in the middle of production can help make a model more interesting in the middle of its run.
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